From “Making Dollars” in 1988 to “Millennium Ducats” since ’99, and perhaps “Mining Dogecoin” in the present, Erick Sermon of the iconic hip-hop group EPMD has always been about business.
And though Erick Sermon may or may not actually be HODLing DOGE, The Green-Eyed Bandit has indeed brought his business to the blockchain. That is to say, the hip-hop legend has teamed up with renowned Canadian-Indigenous artist, record producer, engineer and longtime collaborator David “Gordo” Strickland to create an NFT collection celebrating E-Double’s esteemed career. On Oct. 20, the drop will launch exclusively on Crypto.com NFT, with six pieces featuring original artwork by Strickland — highlighting moments from Sermon’s professional history as a member of EPMD, the founder of Def Squad and as a solo artist.
“Gordo was at the studio doing these abstract hip-hop legends paintings on his down time. He likes to work on music, then take a break and paint, and go back and forth — so he was doing paintings of all of us, and Snoop, and Dre, and Redman and so on. We went to meet Snoop, so I told him to bring the Snoop piece to give [to him]. On the way back from the studio, we talked about the idea of making these into an NFT series — but more like a collab between us.”
Erick Sermon, Creator of “Erick Sermon x David Strickland”
Indigenous Residential School Survivors
Following Canada’s first National Day for Truth and Reconciliation, and Indigenous Peoples’ Day in the United States, the hip-hop luminaries will also be donating a portion of the proceeds from the collection to the Indian Residential School Survivors Society (IRSSS) — a provincial Canadian organization with over 25 years of experience providing essential services to Indigenous residential school survivors and those dealing with related intergenerational trauma, a cause near and dear to Strickland’s heart.
Building Bridges
A Grammy-winning engineer who has worked on projects by artists including Sermon, EPMD, Drake, Method Man, Redman, Pete Rock and Keith Murray, Strickland is also an accomplished visual artist who taps into his Mi’kmaq ancestry — as well as his passion for music and hip-hop culture — to create works that have been displayed at major galleries such as the McMichael Canadian Art Collection. Earlier this year, Strickland won three International Indigenous Hip Hop Awards for his 2020 album, “Spirit of Hip Hop.” The project brought together artists from various North American hip-hop communities, including EPMD and Def Squad alongside staples of Canadian and Indigenous hip-hop communities — from Toronto rap veteran Saukrates to Supaman and Snotty Nose Rez Kids.
“I am trying to build a bridge, because there are so many dope hip-hop artists in the community and outside the community — and sometimes I think that we aren’t aware of each… Well, I want to say each other — but outside the Indigenous community, I don’t think a lot of people understand how [many] amazing artists we have. I’ve been trying to build that bridge to try to open people’s eyes.”
David Strickland, Creator of “Erick Sermon x David Strickland”
Just Like Music
The NFT drop follows acclaimed new music releases by both Sermon and Strickland. The prior recently appeared alongside EPMD group mate Parrish Smith and Eminem on Nas’ ode to the legendary group, “EPMD 2” — a follow-up to “EPMD” from “Judas and the Black Messiah: The Inspired Album,” which features music inspired by Shaka King’s Fred Hampton biopic, and one of the most buzzed-about tracks from Nas’ acclaimed 2021 album, “King’s Disease II.” Sermon is currently working on EPMD’s eighth studio album, “Big Business,” and his long-awaited “Dynamic Duos” producer project — reportedly featuring other celebrated hip-hop duos such as Mobb Deep, Run-DMC, Red and Meth, Heltah Skeltah, Smif-N-Wessun, Black Star, Cypress Hill, Capone-N-Noreaga, Salt-N-Pepa, Naughty by Nature, Tha Dogg Pound, 8Ball & MJG and M.O.P.
The NFT collection itself is being released in promotion of Strickland’s latest single, “Messenger,” a collaboration with Sermon, Saukrates and Outlaw by Nature — a supergroup consisting of Treach from Naughty by Nature and the late Hussein Fatal of the Outlawz, a collective famously founded by Tupac Shakur, to whom the song serves as an homage.
“All the songs we did in the past, there’s always been a message. Whether it be the engineer, the producer or the artist, all of us are messengers and Fatal brought that out — and being he’s passed on, it really resonated with me… I got to capture that in time. I think it’s a stamp with the song and the NFTs, and hopefully we can make some change with both.”
David Strickland, Creator of “Erick Sermon x David Strickland”
Crypto.com NFT spoke with Sermon and Strickland about their personal and professional history together, their entrance into the NFT space, EPMD’s legacy, who would make an appropriate Verzuz adversary for the iconic duo, working on “EPMD 2” with Nas, the Indigenous hip-hop community and more.
“NFTs may be feasible, but being able to use them to help people is what’s more important. I haven’t worked with them before, but I’m honored to be able to help with this drop.”
Erick Sermon, Creator of “Erick Sermon x David Strickland”
Read the Q&A with Erick Sermon and David Strickland below, and visit the “Erick Sermon x David Strickland” drop page for more information.
How did you get into NFTs?
Sermon: Ice-T was the first one to tell me about NFTs, then David brought it up at the studio the next day and we started to talk about if further. I have watched this dude evolve, and this is an example of that… NFTs are a game changer. Def Squad Digital.
Strickland: I got into NFTs through a friend of mine who does my website and was already into cryptocurrency — and Decentraland and other stuff — when he started explaining [it] to me in regards to my artwork. This [was] a couple years ago, so I’ve been working towards doing NFTs for a while.
Erick, you said “NFTs are a game changer”; can you elaborate on what interested you in the space?
Sermon: Yes, [they’re] a game changer because they give more power to the artists!
How were you affected by the pandemic, creatively?
Sermon: The pandemic gave me more time to make music. I think creative people just got more creative from it.
What’s up with “Big Business?” Are you and Parrish still working on the album?
Sermon: “Big Business” is still in the works. There’s no timeline yet, but I’ll keep y’all posted.
How about the “Dynamic Duos” project you’ve been teasing? Anything new you can share about that?
Sermon: “Dynamic Duos” is gonna be special with lots of surprises. Keep ’em guessing — but for real, you won’t believe how amazing it is.
You obviously have a long, storied history in the game — but you’ve always managed to maintain consistency and never seem out of touch; what do you think might differentiate you from some of your peers, in that regard?
Sermon: I live, breath and eat hip-hop every day. My finger’s always on the pulse.
It was great to see you and Parrish rock at Red and Meth’s Verzuz earlier this year. If EPMD were to do a Verzuz, who would you want to go against?
Sermon: If EPMD were to do a Verzuz, it would have to be with Run-DMC. But without JMJ — God bless — I’d say it’s not the same…
Bless! You were also recently featured on “EPMD 2”; how’d that come together?
Sermon: Nas reached out for “EPMD 2.” It was supposed to be a remix, but he made it a new song. Nas is a busy dude, [so] Parrish and I recorded it at my studio and Nas and Hit-Boy did their thing.
I read that you didn’t know Em was gonna be on the track until a week before it dropped. How’d you feel about him being featured and why do you think he was chosen to jump on the track?
Sermon: It was dope to have Em on the track. He did his thing. I think Em was chosen ’cause he has a deep love and respect for EPMD and the golden era of hip-hop.
What’d you think when you heard Nas’ first “EPMD” from the “Judas and the Black Messiah” soundtrack?
I loved it. Nas showed love as usual.
Back to the topic at hand, what was the inspiration for this NFT collection?
Sermon: Gordo was at the studio doing these abstract hip-hop legends paintings on his down time. He likes to work on music, then take a break and paint, and go back and forth — so he was doing paintings of all of us, and Snoop, and Dre, and Redman and so on. We went to meet Snoop, so I told him to bring the Snoop piece to give [to him]. On the way back from the studio, we talked about the idea of making these into an NFT series — but more like a collab between us. Then I let him do his thing and magic happened.
Strickland: After the collaboration for my latest single, “Messenger,” I thought that it would be a good time — because both Erick and I had been talking about doing some NFTs, so I thought this would be a good opportunity for us to do one together.
David, how long have you been making visual art?
Strickland: I started painting as a teenager, but I stopped when I got in the studio, and I started back maybe almost 10 years ago — from doing ceremonies, I just started coming back out again. I’ve done probably almost 500 paintings to date.
With such a bevy of classics to choose from, how’d you pick the songs to commemorate?
Sermon: We picked “Music” because it’s one of my most iconic songs of all time, and the “Rampage” cover he did already — the way it normally is — so it was a good choice to flip to his style and it worked.
Strickland: “Music” is an iconic song, and it really it is a part of my life — and “Rampage,” I’ve actually painted that cover before and that’s one of my favorite EPMD songs.
How’d you guys meet?
Strickland: Erick and I go back a while. I met Erick through Redman. I was in New York, hanging out with Saukrates, and I came out into the lounge. I saw Erick Sermon and the rest is history.
Sermon: I met David through Redman, when he would come down with Saukrates — who was signed to Gilla House at the time. We just became friends naturally through a love for hip-hop — and I started getting him to help me on projects like Keith Murray’s “Rap-Murr-phobia” and Method Man’s “4:21… The Day After.” After that, we never looked back and became like fam.
David, you’ve been behind the boards on records by some legendary artists; do you feel like the role of the engineer needs to be elevated in hip-hop or music in general?
Strickland: Engineers give a lot to the music. Most people don’t even realize the importance of the engineer or how much they add to the music. I feel that their role has been a thankless job sometimes. I think every genre needs to do more to acknowledge engineers, because they’re an impeccable part of the process. Some people end up doing it themselves, but I mean, they still deserve credit.
Engineers are often encouraged to play the cut; did you find it difficult to transition from engineer to artist-producer, or was it a natural progression?
Strickland: Nah, I’ve been making beats [since] before I was engineering. Making the transition from engineer to artist-producer was natural and easy for me because I’ve kinda been doing what I call ghost-producing in the background for years, here and there — adding your little two cents if you’re asked — and you learn things along the way. I’m kinda glad I waited to evolve a little and get my chops up, as they say — and take those experiences, because they come in handy.
Was hip-hop always a part of your life, growing up in Canada? What are some of your earliest memories of the culture?
Strickland: My earliest memories are being seven [or] eight years old, listening to Grandmaster Flash, UTFO [and] all the early old school — the real old school, before Run-DMC. Most people don’t realize new school was Run-DMC, and then that era up until like ’88 [or] ’89 [is old school]. [The group was called] Leaders of the New School for a reason; that’s why they’re called that. So, I mean, yes — hip-hop’s always pretty much been [a part of my life]. I was b-boying in grade school, just for fun, but hip-hop has been there for a minute.
You were raised in Scarborough, Toronto, which I understand isn’t exactly an Indigenous community. Were you as in-touch with your roots growing up?
Strickland: Well, Scarborough does have a reservation; I wouldn’t say it isn’t an Indigenous community. Toronto is an Indigenous land. There were a lot of Indigenous people in my circle growing up. Was I in touch with my roots? A little bit, but not as much as I wanted — because nobody could give me the answers I needed or desired, and some of us didn’t have them. It was a learning process. It wasn’t till things started taking shape, or we were being more recognized back home, that we were able to actually get our status and stuff like that — and learn and find other family members. It’s a pretty scattered history. I could write a book about it.
You’ve made comparisons between the elements of hip-hop and Indigenous music traditions; to clarify, do you believe hip-hop has a direct lineage rooted in Native traditions?
Strickland: Well, that teaching comes from Ernie Paniccioli teaching us the parallels and showing us — because a lot of our kids are interested in hip-hop and not so much in their culture. I think it was kind of like a fork in the road that showed me that what we’re doing in hip-hop is the same as our culture, and maybe I should start learning more about our culture — and the more I learned about our culture, [the more I saw] the parallels. The history is that, as we say, the DJ’s the drummer, the MC’s the storyteller, the b-boy’s the dancer — and the b-girls, [the] breakers — [and] the petroglyph writer [or] sand painter is the graffiti artist… These elements of hip-hop ring through in the elements of our culture, and you could take it deeper with other elements of hip-hop — but it’s all there. Hip-hop has taken many forms over time, and this is an example of it.
Is there a unified Indigenous hip-hop community in Canada? Are there sub-communities within that community?
Strickland: Yeah, there’s a unified Indigenous hip-hop community. In some areas, it’s splintered off these different sub-communities. I think it’s more of [a] regional thing. You have access, so there tends to be communities [that] come together based on geological location.
Regionally, if New York is the Mecca of hip-hop in general, where would you say the Mecca of Indigenous hip-hop is?
Strickland: Whew! That’s a good question. I’d say Winnipeg. I say that because Winnipeg has such a big population of Indigenous people that there tends to be a lot of artists from there. Toronto’s a pretty good hub, but I’d pick Winnipeg because it’s central — and a lot of stuff started from there, in my mind.
What do you think it is about hip-hop that has resonated with the community?
Strickland: Hip-hop is the voice of the voiceless and the same thing applies to Indigenous communities, as far as using hip-hop as a way to tell our stories. I think that’s why it’s resonated so much, and also because a lot of us have different languages; when we’re speaking in English, it’s like a meeting place where we can all come together — because there’s a lot of languages.
How do you feel about the label “Indigenous hip-hop” as opposed to just hip-hop that happens to be created by Indigenous artists?
Strickland: I’ve been against [the label] Indigenous hip-hop. I think it should just be hip-hop, but it’s the community and the artists… Maybe it’s a way to stand out — but at the end of the day, it’s all hip-hop to me; I’ve just been doing hip-hop my whole life.
From your experience, how has the reception to hip-hop made by Indigenous artists been outside of the community? What do you think it’ll take for an Indigenous hip-hop artist to break through the way Drake did for Canadian hip-hop in general?
Strickland: I’m going to say it again: it’s just going to take the right song and the right timing. There’s been a lot of great songs, and sometimes it’s marketing — but it’s going to happen eventually. I don’t know what it’s going to take. I keep pushing, and I encourage all the artists to just keep telling your stories and singing your songs — and don’t just do it to break through; do it because it’s dope.
How often do you see Indigenous hip-hop artists collaborate with other artists and producers, outside the community?
Strickland: I’ve seen that more and more all the time, and it’s good to see — and amazing to see — and I hope it continues.
Would you say that you’re trying to build a bridge between Indigenous hip-hop and other hip-hop artists?
Strickland: I am trying to build a bridge, because there are so many dope hip-hop artists in the community and outside the community — and sometimes I think that we aren’t aware of each… Well, I want to say each other — but outside the Indigenous community, I don’t think a lot of people understand how [many] amazing artists we have. I’ve been trying to build that bridge to try to open people’s eyes.
From your experience, how important would you say intersectionality or solidarity with human-rights issues affecting Black people is in the Indigenous hip-hop community and vice versa?
Strickland: I think it’s very important for solidarity. Everybody, not just Black and Indigenous, but everybody should be in solidarity — but Black and Indigenous people share a similar experience. I think we need to even have our own dialogues to understand each other more, so that we understand what kind of parallels [there are] and allies we can become — because we live a parallel, similar experience from the history.
Across America, many states are beginning to celebrate Indigenous Peoples’ Day — and Canada just held its first National Day for Truth and Reconciliation to honor the victims and survivors of residential schools; how important do you think these sort of symbolic gestures are?
Strickland: It’s a double-edged sword. Here, you have governments making holidays and then building pipelines — saying they want to reconcile and then not showing up for the party. All these gestures are good — but at the same time, we need the meat. It’s a step in the right direction, but there needs to be more changed and more done about all these issues.
Let’s talk about “Messenger”; can you elaborate on the concept and what it means to be a “messenger?” What did you want to accomplish with this song, and how does it relate to the NFT collection?
Strickland: It relates to the NFT collection because Erick and I are on the song. Erick’s on the song, and I’m trying to send a message with the NFTs as well. All the songs we did in the past, there’s always been a message. Whether it be the engineer, the producer or the artist, all of us are messengers and Fatal brought that out — and being he’s passed on, it really resonated with me… I got to capture that in time. I think it’s a stamp with the song and the NFTs, and hopefully we can make some change with both.
I understand you want to encourage other Indigenous artists to enter the NFT space; do you have any plans to educate or help usher in your peers?
Strickland: Yeah, I plan to see how my NFT launch goes — the first one and the second one. Hopefully things go good [so] I can start educating other artists on how to do this — how to go about getting your stuff out there, and execute these types of ventures and capitalize them. Maybe doing meetings or TED Talks type of things, or even YouTube stuff. I’m open to all possibilities.
Can either of you speak to your future plans in the space?
Sermon: We both have plans to do more NFTs. David’s talking about doing an NFT instrumental album with artwork, or we could take it to another level and the NFTs [could] be limited and … used to unlock content in another virtual space — [a] hip-hop virtual reality world. Think about that…
Strickland: I plan on releasing my own collection, another installment of my first — and hopefully a series of different types of styles of NFTs.
Can you speak about the Indian Residential School Society and why you’ve chosen to donate a portion of the proceeds from this collection to the organization?
Strickland: I’ve chosen them as the beginning because this is my first NFT, and because of all the missing children being found in all the residential schools. I thought this would be a good way to kick off the donations because, [with] any NFT drop [I do], I intend to donate to different organizations and Indigenous organizations within Turtle Island — so I thought this was a good place to start, because they also take care of people across the country.
It’s important to me for many reasons. The history of this country needs some healing and we need to start somewhere. I think this is a good place for me to start.
Sermon: I let David pick a cause to donate to for the drop because of what the song we dropped, “Messenger,” relates to — and how passionate he is about helping people. NFTs may be feasible, but being able to use them to help people is what’s more important. I haven’t worked with them before, but I’m honored to be able to help with this drop.
Browse the “Erick Sermon x David Strickland” collection.
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Editor’s Note (Sept. 14, 2022): an earlier version of this article was originally published on the Crypto.com NFT Medium blog on Oct. 19, 2021 and has since been edited and/or updated to republish.
